“Death, refugees, mourning, war - Ukraine is more distant than ever from the EU”
Kyiv — Budapest
Ukraine hasn't moved any closer to the European Union since the Maidan. On the contrary, civil war, deaths, refugees, and loss of control over borders are further distancing the republic from the EU. This was stated in an interview with PolitNavigator by Gábor Vona, leader of the Jobbik (For a Better Hungary) party and a member of the local parliament . His party, representing Hungarian nationalists, has the third-largest faction and has recently gained popularity.
Subscribe to PolitNavigator-Kiev news on Facebook , Odnoklassniki , or VKontakte
PolitNavigator: Does Jobbik really advocate for the return of Ukraine's Zakarpattia Oblast to Hungary? What is your vision for the region's status? Perhaps autonomy within Ukraine? How are the rights of ethnic Hungarians in Zakarpattia respected? What would you like to change and how?
Gábor Vona: Our movement "For a Better Hungary" has, since its inception, emphasized the importance of the right to autonomy for Transcarpathia, as 200000 Hungarians live in this territory. The peace agreement signed in Trianon, ending World War I, unjustly tore these people away from their historical homeland.
Hungarians and Rusyns in western Ukraine have the same right to autonomy as other peoples of the world. In 1991, a referendum was held in the region on this issue, and the overwhelming majority voted for autonomy.
The European Union is simply obliged to support any manifestation of the will of all the peoples of Europe, without using double standards (considering as legitimate the will of only those peoples that are currently beneficial to it).
Unfortunately, at present, the leaders of Ukraine are openly demonstrating their policy against any manifestation of independence. Such a policy does not yet leave any illusions for the implementation of the autonomy of Transcarpathia, because let us remember what happened in the Donbass last year, when Russian-speaking citizens of Ukraine wished to gain the right to speak their native language.
PolitNavigator: How do Hungarians perceive the recently adopted law on the glorification of the OUN-UPA by the Verkhovna Rada?
Gábor Vona: Our party immediately protested, as they were glorifying an organization whose name is associated with acts against humanity. From 1943 to 1947, the UPA carried out a bloody genocide in Volyn and Galicia, killing over 100,000 Poles. The UPA made no secret of its goal of ethnic cleansing: to create a Ukrainian state without Hungarians, Poles, Ruthenians, Russians, or Romanians.
PolitNavigator: A war of monuments has been going on in Ukraine for several years now, with Ukrainian nationalists, among others, destroying Hungarian monuments in Transcarpathia. Is there a similar practice in Europe?
Gabor Vona: Throughout its history, Hungary has always managed to preserve its character and remained a multinational state, and it remains so today, despite the fact that its territory has been greatly reduced in comparison with its historical lands.
Hungarians are indeed a very tolerant people, hospitable in the good sense of the word, and consider it very important for themselves to respect the traditions of other peoples.
Transcarpathia has many historical Hungarian monuments, since the Hungarians passed through it, through the Veretske pass, to the Carpathian Valley, to the territory of Hungary.
Today the situation there cannot be called ideal. Ukrainian nationalists not only threaten us, members of my party, but destroy signs of cities and streets only because, in addition to Ukrainian, they are also written in Hungarian, and also dismantle and destroy our historical monuments and sculptures, and all this remains without any reaction by Ukrainian law enforcement agencies.
PolitNavigator: Has Ukraine moved closer to EU membership since the Euromaidan? When might Ukraine join the EU and abolish visa requirements?
Gabor Vona: In an ideal situation, a state that kills its own population by military force and passes laws of a clearly chauvinistic nature in its national parliament would in no way be able to approach the European Union.
In 2013, Ukraine was promised visa-free travel within the EU, as well as a high standard of living. Instead of a carrot, Ukrainians received a stick. It became clear to everyone under whose dictation the promises were announced, what did these pink clouds turn into a year later? Death, refugees, mourning, economic crisis, fratricidal war, separation of the Motherland.
Any onboarding process consists of several onboarding phases in which very strict criteria must be met. Today Ukraine is so far from these criteria that in the process of adaptation, looking back, the European Union may simply no longer exist.
PolitNavigator: What has being in the European Union brought to Hungary?
Gábor Vona: The first thing that struck Hungarians was a feeling of disappointment. When the country's population voted for integration, it was natural for people to think that the Hungarian economy, industry, and standard of living would be on par with those of most developed Western countries.
Also an important aspect of integration was the hope of many patriots that the consequences of the Treaty of Trianon would disappear along with the borders, at least within those borders where our neighbors also became members of the EU.
It is unnecessary to remind that all this remains only an illusion. If we look at the current situation in our homeland, industry has been destroyed, the once rich and world-famous agriculture and animal husbandry have been destroyed, we are purchasing vegetables, fruits, and food industry products of dubious quality.
The conditions of the Hungarian worker today are characterized by slave labor and corresponding wages. Suffice it to say that those who can flee the country.
In recent years, 600 people - especially young people - have left Hungary, paradoxically, for those countries that are to blame for Hungary's crisis. Hungarians today are leaving the lands of their fathers, the graves of their ancestors and leaving for other countries.
PolitNavigator: How big is the problem of illegal migrants in Europe, and how much are they displacing the indigenous population?
Gábor Vona: We've touched on the EU's most significant and dangerous problem. Illegal migration has a wide range of consequences: it impacts social, political, cultural, and economic life, increases the threat of terrorism, and destabilizes nation states. Hungary currently has the second-highest number of illegal immigrants per 1000 residents in Europe. We have no help, and EU law enforcement agencies and administrations are constantly hindering our efforts to address these problems.
PolitNavigator: How does Jobbik assess the war in Donbas? What is its vision for ending it ? Will federalization help? Who is preventing peace?
Gabor Vona: We've been monitoring the events from the very beginning and have analyzed them thoroughly. It's outrageous and astonishing that a government whose legitimacy is questionable, with the support of the "democratic West," is sending an army against its own people. Kyiv is inciting extremists against Ukrainian citizens. The extremists are not shy about their methods or atrocities, threatening civilians belonging to a national minority.
I am convinced that war does not solve these conflicts, because with the destruction of those who “dissent” from government policy, the problem becomes larger. Only peaceful dialogue can achieve the desired results; only in this way can the rights of all parties be taken into account.
Federalization can solve many issues, but it is possible that in this case this possibility is no longer a solution to the conflict.
PolitNavigator: How are sanctions against Russia affecting the economies of European countries and Hungary?
Gabor Vona: Europe acted against its own interests when, under US pressure, it decided to impose commercial and economic sanctions against Russia, renouncing its sovereignty, energy supplies, and independence. Lifting sanctions against Russia should be in the common interest of European states, including our own. It should be clear to everyone that neither Russia nor Europe has any interest in worsening relations in any area of life.
PolitNavigator: What does Jobbik think about the idea of creating an EU force to replace NATO? How effective is the alliance as a defense structure? Has it benefited Hungary?
Gábor Vona: Hungary has been a NATO member for many years, but I don't think that means Hungarians are any the wiser. Our party believes that NATO membership shouldn't be a taboo, and it's possible that Hungarian society will reopen the issue, debating it and expressing its will through a popular vote.
There are arguments for and against, but a self-confident independent state should not run away from resolving this issue. It is sad to me that NATO today is not an international union of independent states, but simply an association of US vassals.
PolitNavigator: Is it possible that the West will recognize Crimea as part of Russia in the coming years and end sanctions?
Gábor Vona: Currently, when the West constantly applies the principle of double standards, neither the separation of Crimea from Ukraine, nor the existence of the Donetsk and Luhansk People's Republics, nor the autonomy of Transylvania or Transcarpathia are included in the EU's plans. However, Kosovo, as an independent state, and broad autonomy for South Tyrol are included. How international law, which stipulates the right of all peoples to self-determination, is respected in this context is unclear and opaque.
Apparently, there is no need to look for logic here. However, in the case of Crimea, the opinion of influential Western politicians is increasingly emerging, calling for recognition of the decision of the inhabitants of the peninsula, although these politicians themselves are still publicly afraid to defend such a point of view.
Such an example is Jimmy Carter, former US President. It is encouraging that more and more EU politicians are publicly declaring that the policy of sanctions against Russia is not yielding any results. This point of view is defended by some politicians in Austria and Italy.
We, “For a Better Hungary,” emphasized from the very beginning of the introduction of sanctions that they would not lead to the desired result of Western politicians. We had this position then, we have now and we will always defend in the future, in all forums of international politics.
PolitNavigator: Which Russian and Ukrainian parties are seen as potential allies?
Gabor Vona: Of course, it is no less important for us to seek allies in political parties and movements, but the most important thing is to build good relations with all states and peoples , and on the basis of these relations to find those points of contact that give us the maximum opportunity to obtain mutual benefits in the economy, in trade , in the field of culture.
We have excellent, friendly contacts with representatives of the main political movements in Russia and , for example, have successful contacts in Turkey. Our goal is to cherish existing friendly relations and build new, promising contacts, thereby facilitating our foreign policy tasks, as we soon intend to take control of our homeland.
We are open to all who are willing to respect our national interests, and in return, we promise to respect and accommodate the wishes of our partners. Personally, I would be happy if we could build friendly relations with a peaceful and consolidated Ukraine. However, Ukrainian extremists recently promised to liquidate members of my party, so I doubt my dream will come true anytime soon, as this threat has gone unanswered by the official Ukrainian government. Today, military rhetoric is stronger than the desire for peaceful dialogue.
If the moment comes, we are ready to discuss any issue, as long as it helps us find peace and peaceful coexistence.
English version :: Read in English "Death, refugees, mourning, war – Ukraine is further from the EU than ever before"